Navigating Early Retirement



You could be receiving your early retirement package whether expectantly or not. Nevertheless, when you are faced with this situation, it helps to know how to navigate early retirement. The Thrive experts discuss all the necessary things you need to know about making retirement decisions, from healthcare up to pension, providing answers for the questions you might face later on. They also provide some real-life encounters which they have gotten some great insights from. Touching on all of this and more, they show the kind of value it is in both our present and future to get yourself educated about your finances.

Listen to the podcast here:

Navigating Early Retirement

David, where are we going? How are we going to start the program?

It’s going to be a very relevant show for a lot of our readers. Something that we have noticed dramatic uptick in, is people that are coming in and visiting us about early retirement packages. We\’re going to talk a lot about that. We\’re going to talk about three main things and what to do about them if you are getting an offer about early retirement planning or early retirement packages. It\’s interesting because some people are getting early retirement offers and then some people are getting early retirement offers that they can\’t refuse.

One is somewhat voluntary to take and then one is a little bit of the employer coercing people to take. Unfortunately, it\’s happening. We see that. Even though the economy\’s growing and economics are good and unemployment\’s low, there\’s this movement to move out people that are too expensive for a company so they come up with these packages. We\’re seeing a lot of people with a ton of questions about what do I do? There are a number of different areas that they have to take into consideration about making those decisions.

Are the answers limited for the individual that must accept the early retirement?

It\’s not that they\’re limited Joe, but they have to be navigated correctly. That\’s the whole thing. There\’s one time to take a Social Security decision, there\’s one time to make a pension decision. Bret\’s going to bring up some things, Karen\’s going to bring up some things that we\’ll talk about. Maybe our readers are not going through it, but I guarantee it\’s someone they know is going to get some type of a package that they offer. If they\’re offering it, if you come in on a Monday morning and you hear from management that you know there\’s going to be a meeting and we\’re going to be offering 200 packages to employees, it\’s a downsizing that that company is going through and you\’re not going to have much choice. If you try to fight them on it and not take them up on what\’s being offered, navigating that success, they can have some consequences.

Bret, the key phrase in David\’s opening short monologue there was you have to navigate it correctly. If you don\’t have a choice, you don\’t have a choice. You\’re going to make a decision to do something different, but that\’s the key.

It\’s almost like you\’re being voluntold, if that makes sense. You don\’t even have a choice and a decision and it\’s reading between the lines like, \”If I accept this package, this is what’s it’s going to look like,” but if I don\’t, you roll the dice for what happens if they may say, \”You\’re gone,\” and 180 days later and you have nothing to show for it. It\’s all about putting those puzzle pieces together when we\’re offered that severance package and say, \”Is this my last hurrah or do I need to go back to work? How does unemployment work, etc.? We\’re going to chat about all those different things.

Karen, how important for the spouse to be engaged in the conversation that the husband or the wife depending on the scenario?

They should both be involved in that decision. You can only make a pension decision one time. Once you make that decision, it’s going to affect both of you. The same thing with Social Security, you don\’t want to make the wrong decision because it\’s going to affect you in the long run. I can\’t tell you how many times we meet with people and from the time they make their first appointment with us, to the time they come in, it happens in weeks that they are offered a package and they have to make this decision. Something happened that they were supposed to meet us at a workshop and then come and make this appointment. It wasn\’t in their plans, but it does happen.

[bctt tweet=\”If you don’t have the choice, the key is to do something different. \” username=\”\”]

We\’re going to give you details a little bit later on in the program about the upcoming workshop. David, to stay on the subject I imagine when the decision is made or the or when the package is offered, the decision needs to be made quickly and that would support the need to get yourself educated.

The other thing we have to take into consideration, sometimes it\’s unexpected. Humans are creatures of habit. We like stability, we like routine. We don\’t like to get thrown that curve ball. When that curve ball gets thrown a lot of times, emotion ends up kicking in. When people try to make decisions based emotionally, oftentimes they make the wrong decision. The perfect example, we\’ll talk deeper about pensions, but there are lots of times that people make a pension decision by looking at the sheet of paper and they offer four options. Whichever one is sitting at the top of the page because it\’s offering the most amount of money and because they\’re thinking, \”I\’m not going to be working. That\’s the right one to pick.\” Oftentimes, that\’s absolutely not the right one to pick. You want to have as much education, as much knowledge, as many facts as you possibly can to make the right choice at that point.

That\’s what we have tried to do every week on this program is educate. The number one priority is to educate and advocate for the audience.

We\’re creatures of habit and all of a sudden, we’re thrown that curve ball. It\’s like, \”What do we do next?\” That\’s what this show is all about, is seek out professional help in putting all those pieces together because, \”Do I need to go back to work? Don\’t I need to go back to work? How is health care going to work?\” Those are all those things that we\’re going to discuss in the show. Sometimes it\’s the last hurrah and sometimes it\’s, \”I need to go plan for that next job, etc.\”

Quickly set the stage for us, David. What does the framework look like in terms of bullet points or in terms of the top three or the top five areas that you can zero in on?

We\’re going to cover one, to have to make some healthcare decisions depending on age. If you\’re at Medicare, if you\’re not at Medicare, we\’re going to talk about that and that\’s important. Sometimes that\’s the make or break. We’ll talk back a bit about COBRA in that topic. A lot of times that\’s default and it\’s not necessary. We\’re going to enlighten people. The second thing is the pension decision. If there\’s a pension that is offered.

That\’s going to be important because that\’s got longevity. If somebody is fortunate enough to receive it, that brings longevity income into the equation. We have the 401(k). Do we keep it there? Do we roll it over? What are the reasons we keep? What are the reasons we don\’t stay and roll? Tax consequences related to all that. We\’re going to talk a little bit about why and whether it\’s us or somebody else, you should work with an independent financial advisor to do the analysis. To give you the information, to prepare you for those decisions. How important it will be that as you exit that company and you\’re about to sign off that you\’ve consulted with a professional independent financial advisor.

I\’m going to tell one quick thing and this may not be but again, what\’s popular isn\’t always right. There are a lot of news out there and we\’ve got people in our business that are not doing things right. I don\’t know if people read it and saw what\’s going on, but Wells Fargo is a huge financial advisory company inside of a bank. They\’ve been fined over a billion dollars recently in a new lawsuit has been brought up from the DOL, Department of Labor where they are moving people out of very low-cost structure, retirement plans, into high-commission plans. I would tell and caution people be very careful of who you decide to work with when you do this type of planning.

I want to add one thing to what my fantastic husband said. Make sure somebody is independent and also ask them if they\’re a fiduciary. That means that they are legally-bound to make the best decision, not something suitable for you because that can cause high charges in your retirement accounts.

You hear that reference to Wells Fargo and as an individual, sometimes you think it\’s too big to affect you or perhaps if you\’re engaged with them you are being effective.

It doesn\’t stop the press on it. Just because they\’re big and a name brand doesn\’t mean they\’re doing the things right. That\’s a big point.

Talking about what happens if I get that voluntold or I\’m getting that severance package and the very first thing that we need to be concerned with is all about healthcare. Whether you\’re working for a small company or these are some of the companies that David, Karen and I have met with people from. You’ve got Aetna and Pfizer, Merck, Verizon, Pico, Urban Outfitters, Johnson & Johnson, they are some of the companies that we\’ve had employees that we have met with that they have been offered packages and I would tell you no two packages look alike. The very first thing that we need to dig into is that health insurance piece. Most of us in our mind, when we think about retirement it\’s always 66, 67. When we talk about Medicare, we’re eligible at the age of 65, which is all good if we\’re past that age where we don\’t have to be necessarily concerned about. What happens if I\’m 58, 62, 61, whatever that case may be?

You\’re getting a package at 58 years old and you’re seven years out from Medicare.

When you look at that and you got to bridge the gap. A lot of times what you see in that severance package, \”We\’re going to give you possibly some compensation, but also healthcare for the first eighteen months and then it\’s what do we do after that. Some will carry us all the way until the age of 65. Then we have to talk about things like COBRA, meaning once that health insurance stops again, we have the ability to stay on that COBRA plan for up to eighteen months after that package is done. We need to understand the cost that\’s associated with that.

[bctt tweet=\”The other thing we have to take consideration sometimes is the unexpected.\” username=\”\”]

I heard the word COBRA and I got very nervous in my chair.

Before we jumped to COBRA to and discuss the costs, also understand it\’s not routine that most packages that are being offered by employers is going to give you eighteen months of free coverage and then kick into COBRA. Karen and I sat down with a client who\’s in a pharmaceutical company, she\’s 67 years old. She was offered her package and it was one month of severance, one month of health care. Somebody who gets offered a package that does have eighteen months goes, \”I can delay my decision making for eighteen months.\” That\’s not necessarily true either.

The other thing that we need to consider is the Affordable Care Act. When that came out years ago, we got a lot of bad a rap associated with that, but we\’re able to help clients navigate and we chatted on a program a little bit as well. We\’re going to dig a little bit deeper into this show. When we look at the Affordable Care Act and being able to get insurance, meaning health insurance for you and your spouse, it\’s 100% depending upon income, not assets, but about income. If we\’re offered that package, what\’s that plan going to look like in terms of the subsidy that I\’m entitled to through the Affordable Care Act?

Those are the things that we need to navigate and sometimes with a severance package and we talk about unemployment, \”I\’m going to go get on unemployment center so as my severance package has done.\” When you get unemployment it\’s what? It\’s income. It\’s going to affect potentially what my healthcare benefits look like and those can vary greatly. If someone is showing only $30,000 on a tax return versus $50,000 versus $70,000, it doesn\’t sound like a whole heck of a lot. Paying $3,500 for two individuals at $70,000 to $80,000, we\’re paying essentially nothing at $25,000 to $30,000. It\’s all about putting those puzzle pieces together to ensure that we\’re not paying too much from a healthcare perspective.



Is it fair to say that most individuals don\’t know what too much is? Don\’t know what they\’re supposed to be paying? 

People don\’t know when things trigger other events. If you\’re getting a forced retirement or a package offer is you’ve got to know what the sequencing is. Karen, I know you had somebody come in where their adviser gave them advice about their unemployment versus all of that. How did that work and what were the consequences of that? She was laid off and she was with another advisory firm before she came with us. She asked them, \”I\’m supposed to take unemployment, when should I apply for unemployment?\” Her severance package included about ten months of salary. She was still getting paid. They couldn\’t seem to find the right answer to give her until she came to see us. She already made the wrong decision, she started taking unemployment at the same time she was getting her severance pay, so that negated her unemployment. Basically, it wiped it out.

She made that decision on her own.

She did but she was asking for advice and not getting clarity on what she should do.

Be careful who you take advice from, number one. When Bret\’s talking about the health insurance and all, it\’s a little scary and you\’re already in a stressed situation. We\’re here to help you and that\’s what we do for our clients. We have clients that may be the situation\’s going to happen, but let\’s prepare for it, we\’re here for you.

We\’ve seen what Karen just talked about numerous times. It isn’t the first time. Somebody who is between 60 and 65 years old, they probably haven\’t gone through this. \”What do you mean go to the exchange and get insurance coverage? I don\’t know how to do that.\” We walk people through that process. This client of Karen\’s that ended up taking unemployment and her severance at the same time not only negated it. It disqualified her for the unemployment ultimately, but because all that income showed up, she eliminated her subsidy, when she went to go to the exchange to buy the insurance.

Here\’s another perfect example. We had a client who got severance and was going to have her compensation plus her healthcare. She was a free agent. We sat down, we chatted about and looked at everything and I said, \”We\’re going to take unemployment in 2019.\” She\’s like, \”What are you talking about?\” I was like, \”We need to navigate this healthcare piece. I go, “If you take on employment, which is going to be another $13,000 that’s going to show up on a tax return this year. It\’s going to cost us an extra $400 or $500 a month because we\’re going to have all that extra income when we can take it and have a fresh year in 2019, not have too much income there. All of a sudden, we get that subsidy. 

Joe, these couple of examples illustrate why it\’s so critically important to find a good, qualified, independent advisor who understands retirement income planning. Anybody who has received a package or an offer to retire or a forced retirement or knows somebody, should definitely take us up on that complimentary offer.

Two examples and I\’m floored by both of them and what the potential ramifications are by making the wrong decision. A lot of questions by the way, still out there with healthcare. I can\’t encourage the audience more that if you have a question, it\’s okay to call. It\’s not going to cost you anything to get an answer, please educate yourself.



For those of you that may be eligible for a pension, there are some big decisions to make. I talk about it a lot of times during our workshop is we need to ensure that we\’re making the most rational decision possible when we talk about social security and pensions, not the most emotional decision. These decisions are going to stick with us forever. There are so many times when we sit down with people and we talk about pensions because I always take that number at the very top of the sheet, which is the single life pension which means, \”When I pass away, my pension passes away with myself.\” Pensions are becoming not as frequent. We\’re not seeing them as often as we used to. I would say the bigger the company, the more likely that we\’ll have some of that dialogue regarding the pension. \”Do I take a lump sum pension? Do I take that payment that\’s going to give me the greatest amount of money to me on a monthly basis? Do I need to include any survivorship for my spouse?\”

Big decisions and we\’re talking about Social Security being the foundation of retirement income, if you are fortunate enough to have a pension, a lot of times it becomes that pension becomes the foundation of any retirement plan that\’s out there. When we chat about the pension, especially that topic that comes up with a lump sum. A lot of pension plans that we come across have the ability to take a lump sum portion out. It\’s a tax-free rollover. When you do that into an IRA, there are no taxes involved in that process. We have that money that we have the ability to manage on our own or if you work with a financial advisor. One big thing that needs to go into that decision-making is something that\’s called the Kline-Miller Multiemployer Pension Reform Act of 2014. David touches on this quite a bit when we chat about it during our workshops.

[bctt tweet=\”No two packages look alike.\” username=\”\”]

When people hear the word pension it\’s an old school thing, if you\’re fortunate enough to have a pension, it means you\’ve been in a company that\’s done that type of a program for a while and it\’s automatically assumed that if you have a pension, it\’s guaranteed. They do have a thing out there called the Pension Guarantee Fund. The fact that you have to have a fund, quasi-governmental fund out there to support them, tells you that there\’s some issues sometimes. What ended up happening in \’14, in the middle of the night as most laws get enacted that are not favorable for the consumer.

This Multiemployer Pension Reform Act came out and said cutting it down to a quick summary is if your pension fund is underfunded by a certain percentage, that employer for the management of that pension has the right to either reduce your pension payment or possibly even eliminate it. That is scary. For somebody who\’s put in twenty, 30 or 40 years to get that pension. That\’s Federal, State and corporate. As I think many of our audience probably know that most pensions are underfunded pretty darn dramatically.

The three of us here at Thrive have gotten very schooled, very educated about how pensions work. We\’ve employed a specific type of software that can give us guidance on how underfunded a particular pension is. We can help you in that decision making. One of the things people think is, \”My pension is guaranteed, it\’s going to give me a certain amount of income on a monthly basis.\” The question becomes is, \”If I do roll that pension over in a lump sum, I gain control, but can I perform at least as well as that pension would be?\” If you go through that Thrive Retirement Roadmap Review, we can share solutions with you that can give you a good amount of confidence that you would be able to replace the income that that pension was generated. We want as much fixed, almost guaranteed income that you can get on a monthly basis as you enter retirement. Once you\’re there and you no longer have a job, now we\’re working on that “fixed income” situation and that Social Security possibly pension or whatever your retirement assets are going to provide.



Can you imagine getting to the end of a supposed pension and then finding out that it\’s gone?

Sometimes people think this is promotion or hearsay or whatever it is and truthfully, all I’ve got to do is pick up the newspaper or Google it and you will see many mainstay companies, name brands that have discontinued their pensions, have reduced pension payments. It was in Cleveland, Ohio, the Fire Department, the pension benefits and not just for people who were about to enter their pension payments, but people who had been receiving pension payments had been reduced. You\’ve got to be careful when it comes to pensions. Decision making is very critical.

That\’s something we take into account for our clients when we do the review, it\’s a stress analysis on your retirement and we take that into consideration. What happens if your payment is reduced? What happens if it goes away? Plan for that.

Krause, think about it, the topic of this is saying what happens if I was presented a package? Many times, when it comes to that pension, \”If I\’m planning to retire, I have time to think about all these things. I\’m taking my time methodically, slowing down, making sure I make the most educated decision. If I\’m presented a package now and I need to make that decision by next Monday, you make the wrong decision. The encouragement is, that\’s part of that Thrive Retirement Roadmap Review or whether you\’re working with another, is that take the time to sit down with somebody to make the most educated decision possible when it comes to a pension.

I had a client I just met. The mister already had a pension and they\’re going to have two social security checks. She was being presented with a package. She came in, we met for the first time. She was getting ready to go take that 100% survivorship. I was commending her on that. We sat down and went through their needs and again, everyone\’s situations different. When I added up the two Social Security checks about $5,000, another $3,000 from a pension check, there\’s $8,000.

Their need on a monthly basis was about $5,500. They were covering all their needs and I said, \”Do we need another $3,000 a month check?\” Everyone needs another $3,000 check, but what happens with that money when we get it as a pension? I\’m going to pay taxes on it. Could it affect my healthcare? What am I going to do with it after I get all that extra money where we made the decision together, let\’s roll that $2,000 check from my pension that was my lump sum offer to my IRA so now I have control of it. If I pass away tomorrow, my kids get that money. It\’s not kept in the pension fund.

I hope everybody heard that one because a lot of times pension decisions get made. If you pick a single life pension because it\’s the highest payment to you and you pass away early, even if you pass away late and you survived by your spouse, there is no longer cashflow for that person. If you picked a pension payment and tragically passed away, the wife passed away and husband passed away in addition, that pension is gone. There is no beneficiary. There is no residual impact to the family. A lot of times by picking the rollover option, you end up gaining much greater control and protecting beneficiaries and legacy. That’s a big deal.

That\’s a monumental number. it’s unbelievable to me that a decision could be made from ignorance. That\’s what it is. We don\’t know. We don\’t know the answer.

[bctt tweet=\”It’s one thing to have a plan; it’s another to understand the plan.\” username=\”\”]

That same client, Krause, $150,000 in assets sat beyond that pension. They were income rich, asset poor. They had no liquidity. They had $150,000 as long as they could budget everything for the rest of their lives, life would be okay. What happens if while I\’m healthy, I’m in my 50s and 60s and I want to travel more, I want access to my money now? I don\’t necessarily care how much more income that\’s going to give me in my 80s.

I want to be able to enjoy it while I have my health. Putting those pieces together, creating more liquidity, that\’s all part of that Thrive Retirement Roadmap Review. I have a plan for my income distribution, my investments, taxation, healthcare and legacy. Figure out where all those put in. When I get a severance package, all of a sudden things are going through my mind, \”I need to make a decision. I need to make it fast.\” Take a deep breath, pick up the phone. Please call a professional and understand all the options that you have.

It\’s one thing to have a plan, it\’s another to understand the plan.

People like eating sausage, but they don’t want to know how it’s made. Sometimes abdicating all of that activity and that education, people just want a pat on the back, and say everything\’s going to be okay as long as we do it this way. We can give them that peace of mind. 

Do you think there\’s some reluctance sometimes where people have a fear of learning the truth?

We call it the ostrich theory. People sometimes like to stick their head in the sand and hope the problem goes away. We went through healthcare, we\’re now on pensions now or later, lump sum or monthly. You could see there\’s a lot of decision-making ahead. I\’m hoping that this show is presenting enough information for people to feel comfortable, to seek out what they don\’t know. We\’ll answer some questions you have. If you think it needs to go into a deeper conversation, which most times it does, it\’s complimentary. Come on, let\’s talk, and let’s figure it out.

If you\’re the smartest person in the room, you\’re in the wrong room.

I hope everybody out there is taking notes and we\’re trying not to overwhelm you, but this is a very important decision to make when you\’re in the situation. Another problem or another thought that will arise if you get these little packages, they give you your offer and say your decision is you had or have the 401(k) with your current employer or a 403(b), whatever the situation might be, now what do I do? What\’s my best option? We can guide you through that. We can suggest maybe rolling it over like Bret said, but \”What do I do with that after I roll it over? How do I invest my money? What\’s the best way to do it?\” Make sure you do a rollover and don\’t take your money out. There are tax consequences. There are many different consequences to the decisions that you make.

I know to your point, Karen, there are questions out there. I got a text from my college roommate during the show, he texted me right at the very end. I didn\’t have a chance to bring it up during the show. His question was this, \”My IRA is my main retirement vehicle. I have a 401(k) with my current employer, which allows me to rollover to an IRA one time a year. Would your guys, Thrive Financial Services, recommend taking advantage of this rollover?\”

We can\’t say yes for sure. We need to meet you and talk to you, but we can give a general idea.

Typically, the answer is going to be yes. This is a touchy subject when you\’re talking about 401(k)s. David kicked things off talking about what\’s going on in the news out there with Wells Fargo. We need to take that word fiduciary. It\’s a big deal for us. When you\’re talking about these decisions, integrity all of a sudden becomes a big deal. If I\’m in a 401(k) plan where my fees are nonexistent and all of the sudden, an advisor wants to charge me 1.5% to 2% to manage that money, there\’s something wrong with that. It may make more sense to keep that in that 401(k) plan. In pulling that money out, which is what we see makes the most sense, your options become infinity.

When my money\’s in a 401(k) plan, my options are what they are. Maybe it\’s 10, 20, 30, 60 different choices that are out there. You can be a lot more creative. You have access to a lot more options, that\’s to me the biggest thing that we find in pulling money out of a 401(k). We find maybe 3% to 5% of the time it makes sense to keep the money there. Sometimes we find people have a stable value fund that\’s earning 3% guarantee. That\’s almost like a pink unicorn. It doesn\’t exist out there a lot of times. That\’s the biggest thing when you\’re chatting about these 401(k) questions into your college roommate, it\’d be, \”Let\’s go roll that money out.\”

[bctt tweet=\”The decisions we make now are going to stick with us forever.\” username=\”\”]

A big thing is based on age. Depending on the age is going to also determine whether you can legally allow to roll money out of a plan.

Another reason why you may want to keep your money and maybe from a loan standpoint, those are the biggest things that we see out there. You’ve got to be conscious of fees, high and low. What are the flexibility? Meaning the options that are in my plan and then, \”Do I think I\’m going to end up needing a loan?\” A lot of times people entered in their 50s and 60s, things look a little bit different. Things are well, but sometimes I do need access to have that money where I can\’t take a loan from an IRA, I could possibly take a loan from my 401(k).

If I\’ve learned one thing, it is the decisions and the circumstances are as individual as the next person you have a conversation with.



I get a little fired up when I do some of these workshops. What fires me up is the topic of the education. A lot of our audience, a lot of people that we meet in our practice on a weekly basis, especially people who we classify as what we call self-directed. They\’re running their own financial plans. A lot of people are going to these resources, there\’s so much information out there. I\’ll give you a couple examples. People go out for this information and they base their decisions on this generic information and a lot of times it causes more harm than good. I\’ll give you a couple quick examples. did this whole article thing on this concept called the 4% rule. The 4% rule being the ideal withdrawal rate out of your retirement assets so that your retirement assets will last at least 30 years of retirement. It\’s like that number that I can count on is my stress number. The next month, came out with another article that said the exact opposite. It said that the 4% rule is the worst rule that’s ever been created, don\’t count on it, don\’t use it. A lot of people are going making their decisions based on what they hear on radio or what they see on television or what they read in internet or newspapers, whatever it may be. Every circumstance is unique and you can\’t base a decision on this generic resource information that\’s out there. It can be very damaging.

When it comes to 401(k)s or 403(b)s, and now you\’ve been offered a package and you have the opportunity to rollover, we\’ve got to go through a flowchart of things to see if it makes sense. Some of the positives of why to make that rollover decision and move that money into either an adviser driven or a self-directed IRA, much greater flexibility. Most plans that are sponsored by employers have a limited amount of options of what you can invest in. When it comes to investing, one of the wisest things is proper diversification. If you\’re limited to a certain amount of investment options, different types of mutual funds, very rarely do you see ETFs and things of that sort, then you\’ve narrowed your flexibility to have the world be your oyster as far as decisions go.

[bctt tweet=\”It’s unbelievable to know that decisions could also be made from ignorance.\” username=\”\”]

Moving to a self-directed IRA or an adviser directed IRA, you at least have a limitless amount of options so that\’s one, flexibility. Number two is control. Sometimes these 401(k) or 403(b) plans put rules on these plans on what you can do and what you can\’t do. There may be times that you need money and they may not have a loan offering, they may not allow you access. One of the things that we were talking about age-driven is certain funds and I\’d say the majority of bigger Fortune 500, Fortune 1000 companies offer what\’s called a Non-Hardship In-service Withdraw option. That means if you have obtained the age of at least 59 and a half that you are able to rollout your assets. Move them out of your 401(k) into self-directed or adviser-directed plan, but still keep your 401(k) active.

As an example, like your college roommate is asking, should I do it? On the surface? We need more information, but it looks like if he\’s achieved the age of 59 and a half and him being your college roommate, I assume he hasn\’t. He\’s not. Then he may be limited even though they\’re offering, he may not qualify for that. We have to take a look at it. That\’s part of control, flexibility, and control fees. There was a report that we saw on 60 minutes.

Where they said the average fees inside of a 401(k) was like a little over 3%, which is nuts.

When you start to look what\’s transparent and what\’s not transparent, the average fees that are in 401(k)s is about 3%. Before you even get started, you’ve got to perform at least 3% to break even. People don\’t know that.

They send out that book with its 200 pages every year, so that people know it.

The importance of getting educated and applying, understanding your circumstances to me is what I take every week. Get to Thrive Financial Services and get the answers or get the understanding at least that you need. On behalf of David and Karen Bezar, thank you very much. Bret Elam, thank you as well. On behalf of everyone, I\’m Joe Krause. See you next time.

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